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Author Topic: advice for a route to modestly increased sexual pleasure with a partner  (Read 3494 times)
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« on: August 07, 2008, 05:43:21 PM »

advice for a route to modestly increased sexual pleasure with a partner [female or otherwise].

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H
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  Date Posted: 11/28/2004 9:24 PM           
 

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hello, i've been browsing around this forum for hours now and i figure it's time to save myself some researching and just post a few questions.

there seem to be three routes that keep showing up.

1.) Glans Stimulation (Darkwhite/FlamingPole's method). From waht I can tell, this method couldn't work for intercourse (whether vaginal or anal), as it's whole basis seems to be on stimulating only a certain region. From waht I can read, on everyone who it's been successfull with I've heard no stories of it being during intercourse. I'm not interested in learning to have pleasure on my own, or on having pleasure that requires a great deal of effort on my partner's [who happens to be female, if that's important, which I don't think it is] part--besides, I've never been very turned on by oral sex. It works wonders, but, to me it's a very second-rate thing to being able to actually see a person and be a lot more physically intimate with them. Can someone verify once and for all whether or not Glans Stimulation would ever be helpful in intercourse? I'm not a fan of the excessive masturbating [or someone doing it for you with their tongue--not much difference, a pretty detached experience as far as I'm concerned] it seems to require, either; I'd much rather avoid masturbation altogether.

2.) "Key Sound" or "KSMO" (PanDragon seems to be a rather militant defender of this method--probably because it seems that it has sincerely worked for him and people he knows, but I, like others, can't help but be a bit put off by his tendency to claim it as the only revolutionary thing and to always refer people to a $30 CD; I mean, the whole thing reminds me of Woody Allen's "Everything you wanted to know about sex..." with the sexologist mad scientist who, if I recall, had a name as absurdly perfect for the sex-help industry as "Jack Johnson"--I mean, come on, is this a stage name? I wont discount this method flat out, becuase it obviously works for some people, but it's last on my list to try, because of the noise it requires [I don't hold back on making noise, I just have never been vocal at all, it feels unnatural to me--sighing is one thing, but using hte voice box is another, it seems out of place in an experience that to me is primarily tactile])..... This methods seems like it can work for intercourse and supposedly it's supposed to be more intense and full than the PC control method. What I REALLY REALLY hate about it, is that it seems like a set of training wheels you never remove fully. Sure, I can believe that psychologically making a sound can help relax someone or sensitize someone, but, really, you're confusing cause for effect if you think that the Key Sound does some magic--the key sound is an effect caused by specific bodily pleasures. It should be a direct route--bodily pleasures==>bodily orgasms. The idea that the pleasure has to pass through the magic 'key' sound, is to me, even if it works, a really bad philosophy and a really bad ritualizing of what should be a spontaneous and flexible activity. Further, that it has to be a really specific sound is hack-psychology at best. If we're dealing with a psychological problem, not a problem of accoustics, the nature of the sound should be allowed to vary, and what Jack Johnson should be selling is not a WAV file but a course, a program of learning how to open yourself up to something. The idea that he's copyrighting the sound as some special secret pseudo-scientific whiz-bang, makes me want to refuse giving him $30 even if he could help me. I'd gladly buy or check out a book or CD of his if it was something otherwise public domain of which his lectures and sound-advice HELPED. Instead, he puts up a $30 toll to his 'discovery' and sells the tap shoes instead of the tap dancing lessons. I'd try the tap-dancing trick if it was public domain and then, if it failed, go find the great instructor. Maybe PanDragon can pass that bit of advice on--if Jack Johnson has a serious offering enough to not stake his claim on a magic WAV file.

3.) "PC control" whatever that means. According to both Darkwhite and PanDragon, their methods (KSMO and Glans Stimulation) do not require this. Of course, it seems PanDragon thinks Glans Stiumulation does require PC control. In any event, I've got no issues with the idea of 'holding back.' I'm fine if an orgasm is 70% or whatever 'differentiating' we want to make of it--if it's pleasurable, I'd be happy with it, so long as I would be able to have multiple and eventually [if wanted] have an ejaculatory orgasm. My only worry is that a lot of people supposedly have trouble with this method--but is this simply because they're expecting a bunch of full-blown orgasms? In any event, as far as I understand it the technique is the same regardless of how it's prescribed: learn to control the muscles that participate in the ejaculatort-orgasmic process in order to learn to seperate orgasm from ejaculation and delay full ejaculation and the fatigue/refractory period. I saw a graph somewhere that showed several peeks and then finally an ejaculation. This is fine with me, I know it might not be as impressive as what Glans or Key Sound appear to offer, but it has a simplicity that sounds reasonable enough: seperate ejaculation and orgasm, and learn to control the ejaculation which is the thing that causes the "game over" as someone put it.

-- From what I've heard, I can do this by practicing holding and flexing the muscle and by trying to stop stimulation right as close to the ejaculation as possible and hold 'PC' [and I"ve heard some dbeate on whether that's the muscle your holding or not] muscles to fight off the ejaculation, then continue to maintain arousal and repeat the process. Of course, all the usual rules of bodily sensitivity apply: be as relaxed as possible, breath well, so forth. The one specific tip I've heard is really make sure not to flex anything OTHER than the PC muscles--focus on them, and of course, try to remain relaxed in the legs, buttocks, so forth [with specific tip of keeping knees bent].
Am I getting all of this right?


Now, short specifics of my situation so that someone can tell me whether I have other issues or not: up until a couple of years ago I had normal orgasms. Fairly short into intercourse, I could either orgasm or hodl it off a bit and eventually have a full orgasm. This was always in intercourse or oral sex, I don't make a habit of masturbating. Over time, and I'm not sure when it happened and whether there's a cause-effect relationship or not, but, two things happened:

1.) I became increasingly able to go long periods of itme without orgasming. At this point, I feel somewhat not that sensitive. This may be somewhat psychologically, because sometimes the sensitivity is plenty high. But, in any event, without much mental effort, I can put off orgasm quite indefinitely, with either boredom or increasing self-consciousness [of being in control of it and the whoel process then seeming mechanical] setting in if I put it off too long. This is odd, as far as I know, because I'm relatively in-my-prime [mid twenties] and I'm also uncircumcised [we're the ones who are supposed to have 80% or some astronomical number higher sensitivity].

2.) My orgasms always feel stunted. They come on normally, but it ends up being all hype with an orgasm. There's no feeling of release and even though there's hte spasms and all of that, it feels like I'm holding back [at one point for a few months it felt like I had to pee but was holding back to keep from peeing--but when testing out this theory by masturbating and feeling more comfortable "letting go" the orgasm was just as stunted and, put simply, rather all the more unpleasurable since there wasn't a human being to at least give a bit of emotional pleasure to it]. I've looked around online and can find almost nothing about this sort of condition, but one poster here ["J.B."] described it similarly in some ways [except I have full ejaculation]:

my orgasms have become weaker over time so that occassionally I ejaculate and feel NOTHING at all. I like to say that a man has one orgasm at a time as a teenager; by the time he is 40, he has 1/5th or 1/10th of an orgasm [J.B.]

That's how it feels, except it's not so much a 1/5th as much as an /incomplete/ orgasm. It's almost not an orgasm at all when it's worst, and when it's best it's extremely frustrating half-orgasm, where you want to continue becuase you're on edge but you've already ejaculated and are rapidly loosing arousal. Unlike J.B. I have full foce behind my ejaculations, though [he associated low force behind the stream of ejaculant with the reduced orgasmic pleasure].

Any thoughts and advice on methods? My hope is that working with the PC method, which could seperate ejaculation from orgasm, would allow me to regain my original orgasms or at least have pseudo-orgasms that are complete in their own sense [whether or not the sort of "ORGASM" orgasm, i just mean bodily sensations that seem to have a beginning, a middle and an end, cause right now i get a beginning and the edge of a middle and that's that].

Thanks!
H
 
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Edwin
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  Date Posted: 11/30/2004 4:40 PM           
 

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Hi!

I just like to share some of  my experiences with you.. since you asked

I have read your post and I can totally relate to what you have said. 5 months ago I was at the same point you are now : searching, gathering information about how to improve things.  Also like you, I'm a pretty skeptic person, especially about things like these... and KSMO didnt pass my valibility(?) test. You only get one first impression and the website was simply not convincing. So I turned to PC muscle training with the help of a book ("How to make love all night" - Barbara Kiesling). I finished the book and exercices and although it gave me (at some level) what it promised, I was pretty dissapointed. I couldn't  enjoy being 'multi-orgasmic' this way at all. Don't get me wrong, I'm glad I did it for obvious reasons, but I expected much more out of it. I couldn't believe I was so excited in the beginning.. over this.

Looking back at it now, I think I was so dissapointed that I was ready to try anything.. even KSMO. I started as a non-believer, but it only took me one session to begin having some faith in KSMO and one week to become a believer. I would be lying if I said I already experienced a KSMO orgasm after so many months, but I feel good about that, the pace feels right (most of the time ) and I really enjoy the near-orgasmic feelings I have in my sessions. At this point I can tell you that my life has already been greatly enriched by this practice. Even regular orgasms feel more powerful than ever (mind blowing!) and that's even without using the Key Sound.

I understand your reasons for putting KSMO at the last spot in your list, but why would you wait for the perfect methods to achieve perfect bliss, if you can already achieve just that with an arguably still rough method named KSMO?

 
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Edwin
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  Date Posted: 11/30/2004 5:04 PM           
 

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Regarding the 2nd part of your post I have to say that a strong PC muscle does in fact improve the quality of regular orgasms. However, when using the PC Squeeze method, things start to get unpredictable. One time I kept delaying the final orgasm.. and when I finally let go (huge buildup), I felt nothing.. absolutely nothing. Even weirder, I didnt ejaculate at all.. all that hard work for nothing! I was very disturbed by that.

Luckily KSMO helps even more than a strong PC muscle, even when not using any Key Sounds at all. I never thought orgasms could become as intense as they are for me now.
 
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